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" Records of births and baptisms, marriages, deaths and burials peformed by priests in Croatia. Includes vital records of Jews, Orthodox, Greek Catholic, Evangelical Church, Civil and Military records
These records may be in Latin, Croatian, Cyrilic, German and Italian"– Latin, Croatian, German and Italian are – languages.
CYRILLIC is a script – Serbian language uses both the Cyrillic script (ĆIRILICA) and the Latin script ( LATINICA).
Serbian language Cyrillic scrip (ĆIRILICA):
-Church vital records of the Serbian Orthodox Church in Croatia are written in OLD CHURCH SLAVONIC language (crkvenoslovenski).
Old Church Slavonic language Cyrillic script:
Update :
-according to the taped interview with your grandfather, names of his siblings, in order of birth:
OSTOJA
ADAM
JOVAN
KRSTIVOJ (three years older than your grandfather)
your grandfather : MILE LOVRIĆ ( he pronounces it out clearly as a clear blue sky) /mile/.
*MLADEN ( younger than your grandfather, died at the age of 12)
and two older sisters.
-in part 1 of the interview he says the name of the father in his native tongue :
"it was ĐURO " /djuro/
-in part 2 he says the name of the mother :
MILICA / mil'tza/
-name of the younger sister
SOFIJA /sovija/
-name of the uncle , brother of his father, who lived in the same household , went to US and returned –
BOŽO LOVRIĆ / bozho/ – he was younger than your great-grandfather ĐURO LOVRIĆ, and they had no other siblings living in that household.
part 2 – he says, answering the questions about the name of the village:
…."you mentioned name …next village"
-grandpa: " JAVNICA" ( / javnitza/
-grandpa " town …DVOR...sounds like war" ( it does, actually :D)
"…and the village where your farm was…"
grandpa : "KOTARANI" ( he pronunced it : /ko'tAran/ – I put capital letter on the *A* that is stressed, and swallows the ending sound "i" (short *eee*)– house number – you still remember that
-grandpa : "fifty five".…"Did your family always live there?"
-grandpa : "Sure!".
-school – not in the village.
grandpa: "…I had to walk nine miles to school " . correct. Parish school was in Javnica village ( I do not know the distance though).
–church
" was in the village , it was Orthodox, no , no not Catholic…there were no Catholics around in that place there , it was all Orthodox" ( Serbian Orthodox Church temple that was burned and completely destroyed in 1942. was indeed located in the village of Kotarani, and the village was populated by Serbs only) .
-middle name given at baptism – no middle names among Serbs, they were baptized immediately after birth and their baptism given name IS their first name – that is why even when *pushed* by your father, he said he did not know the middle name of anyone in his family, including himself. 🙂
(remains of the Serbian Orthodox Church temple in Kotarani)
-For reasons unknown your grandfather was clearly uncomfortable and got all fidgety when asked directly if he was Serbian or Croatian. He rerouted the question with the defense of *everyone being Austrian* back then. ( Same when he was asked about the language, I think he replied : " oh Serbia, Serbia were not down there – indicating that he was trying to convey how he was NOT from Serbia. )
*** He states that his name is MILE LOVRIĆ – which does indeed mean that he was maybe registered in church records as MIHAJLO – the variant of the name that was officially *acceptable* by church standards. His travel documents, issued based on church birth certificate, had that name – MIHAJLO LOVRIĆ in them – which was then written into the ship manifest. No mention of him traveling under other persons name anywhere on the tape – he would have mentioned it for sure, so I think that any story of a different name he traveled under is about the MIHAJLO – MILE difference . This was common occurrence with all first names among ethnic Serbs and their shorter, more *common* variant
JOZEF-JOZO, LAZAR-LAZO, VASILJ -VASO, BOŽIDAR-BOŽO, NIKOLAJ – NIKO, STEVAN -STEVO, PETAR -PERO, KRSTIVOJ-KRSTO, GEORGIJE – ĐURO, GAVRILO – GAVRO….
So he did remember it correctly – EVERYTHING, down to the household number. Amazing man.
All of this is confirmed by the records I posted for you earlier. It was a pleasure and honor to listen to your grandfather tell his story.
You will be patient, I took notes and transcribed most of it, but due to the backlog of other projects it will take me a week or two to type it out, illustrate with period photos and provide notes explaining about the life, customs, places he mentioned.
super!
evo još za porodičnu istoriju – dobrovoljci koji su iz Amerike došli da se bore za Srbiju 1912-1918, iz knjige Ilije Petrovića :
Ps. your private messages inbox is full .
Prezime ADEGA imate navedeno i objašnjeno kao prezime u knjizi koja se bavi onomastikom rumunskih prezimena u Vojvodini / Srbiji.
izvor: Mircea Samoila :"Viata Numelui" , 2002.
o prezimenima i imenima i običajima vezanim za njih u manjinskim zajednicama u Vojvodini takođe možete pogledati ovde:
http://www.rodoslovlje.com/en/documentation/given-names-nicknames-and-surnames-vojvodina
i ovde:
http://www.pzv.org.rs/files/sr/zbornik7_konacna_verzija.pdf
To be able to help you more we need to know more – place of origin of your ancestors, their first names, names of their immediate family members that stayed in the old country.
Usually a good place to start are Privrednik database records – there is a number of KOEN merchants and shop owners from Belgrade listed in it:
YEAR SURNAME, FIRST NAME, PROFESSION, CITY 1924 Koen J. Solomon, tapater, Beograd 1927 Koen Solomon, tapetar, Beograd 1927 Koen Solomun, trg. Beograd 1927 Koen Solomon, tapetar, Beograd 1927 Koen Solomon, tapetar, Beograd 1928 Koen Salomon, tapetar, Beograd 1929 Koen Avram, vulkanizator, Beograd, Resavska 33 1934 Koen A. Isak, trg. man., Beograd, Kr. Milana 41 1934 Koen L. Žak, fotograf, Beograd, Sarajevska 62 1936 Koen A. Isak, trg. man., Beograd 1937 Koen A. Filip, obućar, Beograd, Dobračina 12 Seecond source of publicly available records would be the official census of WWII victims.
I will post that information later after I translate it, as the list is heartbreakingly long when it comes to KOEN family from Serbia.
photo: Jewish community building on Kralja Petra Street. These are the members of the board that was resposible for building the new synagogue, Bet Israel, on Cara Urosa Street. The photo was taken in Belgrade in the 1900s. The building committee for the Bet Israel synagogue from left to right: Seated: Josif Pinto, Menahem Koen…
"A large group of Sephardi Jews arrived in Belgrade in 1521, immediately after the Turkish conquest of the city. Unlike the native Romaniot Jews, who at that time already dwelled along the Sava River, Sephardim settled along the Danube, in the Turkish part of the town called Dortjol, where they soon formed a Jewish quarter, the mahala(from Turkish mahalle), which they named Jalia (from the Turkish yali – waterside residence). For the history of Belgrade’s Jews, see:
Ženi Lebl, Do “konacnog rešenja” – Jevreji u Beogradu 1521–1942(Belgrade, 2001), 4–5 (published also as Jennie Lebl, Until the “Final Solution”: The Jews in Belgrade 1521–1942 [Bergenfield, NJ, 2007] );
Ignjat Šlang, Jevreji u Beogradu(Jews in Belgrade) (Belgrade, 2006; first ed., 1926); Zbornik jevrejskog istorijskog muzeja, no. 6 (a collection of articles about the Jews in Belgrade published by the Jewish Historical Museum (Belgrade, 1992).
Divna Ðuric-Zamolo “Stara jevrejska ˇcetvrt i Jevrejska ulica u Beogradu” (The Old Jewish Quarter and Jewish Street in Belgrade), Jevrejski Almanah 1965–67: 54."
source:
