[yugaya]

All vital records  of the churches in Croatia were taken to municipal offices in 1948.

The municipal offices were in most areas not destroyed, and even the vital records that were taken by the refugees in 1995. have been returned to the Croatian State Archive .- HDA.

All original church vital records, as well as civil copies of them are now stored in regional state archives ( Karlovac, Zadar, Osijek…).

Any record older than 100 years is open for public research – so anyone born/married /or died before 1912 can be researched without any legal or privacy law restrictions.

As far as the treasures from the Serbian Orthodox Church monasteries and eparchy libraries that were destroyed go, it is an immesurable loss to our culture and heritage. Some of these almanachs and original materials  are now only available in second-hand resources, the scientific books and papers of the scholars who researched them until 1995, like this one by Vladimir Mošin published in 1970 titled " OLD MANUSCRIPTS OF THE SERBS IN CROATIA  XIII – XX  CENTURY":

My profile picture is an archival photo of the library in the monastery DRAGOVIĆ in Dalmatia, which was the parish centre my ancestors belonged to before 1600. All of it is gone.

The bulk of these treasures was destroyed during the Ustasha NDH regime 1941-1945. The manuscripts and treasures that were stolen have never been returned to the SOC, either by the communists or the Republic of Croatia.

Unfortunately, the latest news on the fate of the old manuscripts and records other than vital for SOC in Croatia that survived  WWII and are stored in state archives is equally discouraging – even the vetted historians and chuirch diginitaries are denied access without explanation, and for some of the most valuable old manuscripts  ( XIII century) there is no information available on the current location and level of collection availability because they are not  listed in published lists of archival holdings of the same museums that  had them in their posession before 1991.

Because no one has been able to access them recently, there is no information on whether they are even kept  and stored in the required  way to preserve them. 

Additional hurdle to be considered is the fact that even the most recent catalogs of archival holdings do not identify Serbian Orthodox Church or its eparchies  as central authors , except for two collections that are partial.

For anyone researching the sources of the Serbian Orthodox Church in Croatia, here is an article (in Serbian) by a historian Mr Goran Latinović from the Banja Luka University  that has the most detailed and recent information on the collections of the SOC in archives and museums in Croatia:

http://www.eparhija-gornjokarlovacka.hr/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=446:fondovi-i-zbirke-srpske-pravoslavne-crkve-u-hrvatskim-arhivima-i-muzejima&catid=17:novosti&Itemid=13&lang=hr

If you are a SGS member we will look up the archives and identify holdings relevant for your research (school registers,  land ownership records, SOC documents) and translate the information you need to continue researching your ancestry.

[yugaya]

429

1889

Došen

Petar

Ilijin

41 Brezovac, Rakovica

This is from the information database on the cadettes whose apprenticeship was sponsored by the Serbian Trade Association "The Merchant" . This person , Petar Došen, son of Ilija, household number 41, from the village of Brezovac that belonged to Rakovica county at the time, started his apprentziceship in the year 1889. He would have been ten years old at the time (  count  +/- five years  becuse some cadettes went away as small children, and some after they finished primary school).

 In the same record there is one entry for the other location you mentioned – Inđija:

36430

1943

Došen

Radivoj

Gojkov

Moja Volja, Inđija

You can contact this organization for more inforormation, or see with your family members if they know of them.

You have not provided information on when your family moved to  Vojvodina .

The revised victims lists for WWII casualties from Vojvodina with names cross-checked and added based on research 2002-2008  have three Došen  family members listed as victims  that were  residents of  Jarkovci , Inđija municipality:

Došen (Jovan) Dragan, Jarkovci, rođen 1923. Srbin, ubijen 1941. u NOBu,
Zimnjak (0179030004)

Došen (Jovan) Dušan, Jarkovci, rođen 1926. Srbin, poginuo 1944. u NOBu,
Virovitica (0179030003)

Došen (Nn) Đuro, Jarkovci,  rođen 1883. Srbin, umro 1941. pri deportaciji,
Drenovac (0179030006)

 

If you are a SGS member we can help you get in contact with the original family from Croatia, as they will be able to help you with archives and information on your ancestry there, cemeteries etc.

 

 

 

[yugaya]

I do believe that the accurate information on how to contact archives is important and email queries in English  are not considered to be  an official channel which must be answered by them.

I forgot to add that if you are sending the official form to municipal offices for information from civil vital records, in most cases you  must document that you are the descendant of the person you are obtaining the birth/marriage/death ceritificate for – the information is considered confidential and is protected by privacy laws .

[yugaya]

Orlići su se u Brinje doselili1638. godine kao Srbi pravoslavci. 1910 ih je popisano osamnaest kuća u Vodoteču. Istorijske izvore za ove podatke potraži u knjigama "Spomenici hrvatske Krajine" , "Seobe i naselja u Lici" i "Plemenski rječnik Ličko-Krbavske županije". Osim okvirnih podataka o tome da su te grupne migracije bile *iz Turske krajine* i da su se porodice zadržale na prvobitno dodeljenim imanjima, dalje istraživanje porekla bi zahtevalo dosta vremena i konsultovanje izvornih dokumenata i naučne literature. Takvu detaljnu pretragu, zbog ograničenosti vremenom i resursima , mogu napraviti samo za članove SGD Rodoslovlje.

[yugaya]

 

Šabac had no Obilić nobility that lived in the castles at the time Andria Obilich was  supposedly born to a master of one – it was a crude military fortress reinforced by the Austrians,  in which and later around which people settled, that was originally built by the Ottomans and not Serbian kings

The essay is a nice piece of literature, but  I think Sergej and others will be better at explaining why, the link it portrays with Kosovo battle nobility, heroic kings and legendary Obilić remains in the realm of literature, not genealogy or history . Have you checked the Saxony archives – the surname  variants  of *Boyne* and several toponyms exist there, that are the  likely origin of it. I would look closely into records of soldiers who served in Belgrade-based regiments and fought there.

 

Čedomilj Mijatović, as far as I can remember from my English lit lectures where he ended up on the account of his works in English and translations, had a penchant for bending the historical facts into romanticized tales and dabbling into the occult . Even his objective biographers admit that his historical novels are* literary glorification of medieval Serbian history* .  He was a  vivid and  extraordinary Byronesque figure in our history,  . Any original correspondence of his would be of great historical value, so I am very interested  to see them if you have copies of his letters you mentioned. He did entertain quite a large number of people who claimed descendancy to Serbian throne in various parts of the world during his career and published articles on them – apparently , it was a popular thing back then .

 

The essay  by Eugene Schuyler on the descendant of serbian kings is a beutiful addition to your family legend and is interesting for us here, but as far as facts go, you would need to have any original document or person mentioned in it  validated by historians first to corraborate and check each piece of the information against existing documents and sources  – vital recors, conscription records, military reports, official correspondence. It is typical  of this and other Western works, the way in which they include bits of original folk tales and local history fact to corraborate and construct – a story.

 

The main inconsistency about the account of the funeral is that it is highly unlikely that a serving Prime Minister  at the time (Jovan Ristić if the year of death is 1873, or Stevča Mihailović if the year of death was 1877) would have attended a burial of anyone in the section of the cemetery reserved for the poor .

Also, the City Hospital director  at the time was dr. Jovan Valenta.

I would  appreaciate it if you send me the original death certificate of August Boyne (rather than the translation or transcript), only based on that original document I can check if any records exist of his burial in the archives of Serbia and direct you further . The original old cemeteries were transfered from the growing  inner  city after your ancetor was buried to a new location. As the graves in the poor section on the city land were usually unmarked and without headstones or family who paid for its keeping,  you can probably only look for the reconstruction of the approximate location of the original grave. My email is [email protected]

[yugaya]

Probaj ovde:

http://www.gruza.rs/podaci/istorija/istorija

 

i ovde:

http://www.kotraza.rs/rodoslovi.html

Obično kada kontaktiram ljude koji su vlasnici ovakvih lokalnih portala dobijem pomoć u vezi istraživanja porodice, kontakt sa potomcima koji žive u tom kraju i mnogo, mnogo podataka koji su od ogromne važnosti.

Takođe, pokušaj da dođeš u posed ove knjige:

http://www.knjizara.com/knjige/knjiga/129438_Gru%C5%BEa+-+naselja,+poreklo+stanovni%C5%A1tva,+obi%C4%8Daji_ISBN:978-86-519-0612-4

u njoj je nekoliko naučnih članaka o etnologiji i poreklu stanovništva tog kraja od vrlo uglednih autora.

 

U selu GRIVAC blizu Gruže zabeleženi su ĐORĐEVIĆI – starosedelačka porodica  (iz vremena pre prvog srpskog ustanka 18044. godine ) kao grana starog roda BELOBRKOVIĆ.

na sajtu gore o Kotraži ima veliki rodoslovi Đorđevića odatle i drugih mesta, izvor- crkvene matične knjige i popisi:

http://www.kotraza.rs/Djordjevici.pdf

http://www.kotraza.rs/Djordjevici%20Koletina.html

Za pomoć oko arhiva i matičnih knjiga u kojima ćeš naći pretke moraće da se javi neko upućeniji od mene. 😀

[yugaya]

There are cemetery records available and people who can do this query on your behalf we can recommend . If you are a member of SGS Rodoslovlje  send me a PM and I will arrange it – BUT:

 

-you will need  to provide the correct ORIGINAL spelling of the surname for the period, and more information -year  of birth, religious affiliation.

 

What is the *von Lazar* referring to – is it a nobility title that can be substantiated, the name of his father, a separate second surname (Hungary) ….?

[yugaya]

Što se ranijih popisa  tiče, veliki broj je obrađen u naučnim radovima – evo ovde imate detaljan prevod i prepis popisa za Mitrovicu, Rumu i tada pripadajuća sela iz godine 1720 :

http://scindeks-clanci.nb.rs/data/pdf/0352-5716/2009/0352-57160980071B.pdf

Ruma

Mitrovica

Jarak

Hrtkovci

Platičevo

Baradinac

Krstac

Vitojevci

Miškovci

Đurđevci

Buđanovci

Kraljevci

Dobrnici

Petrovci

Putinci

Radinci

Jelenci

Voganj

Šašinci

[yugaya]

Both surnames – Zorić – and of the person she is travelling with – Đorđević –   whose husband is listed as her contact destination are found in the village SRPSKI ITEBEJ, in Zrenjanin municipality, Vojvodina, Serbia.

 

You will have to contact the archives in Serbia for civil vital records and church vital records ( if they are available on microfilms).

 

Consider joining SGS as a paid member – the service of helping with contacting  the local archives and translating correspondence and requests is included.

[yugaya]

Bosna, XV vek.

 

[yugaya]

HI:)

You must contact the authorities in Brčko in regard to this family. The family LUKIĆ from that village was hard hit during the recent wars.

http://www.bdcentral.net/index.php/ba/vlada/kontakt

(last one on the list is the registrars office)

Try writing to the Serbian Orthodox Chruch youth organization there too (the priests associated with it would be most likely to answer emails in English and be willing to give you information about ethnic Serbian family) :

http://www.soz.web44.net/contact.html

"Looking for relatives" web portal  in Serbian language:

http://www.trazimo.info/topic.asp?kat=1&str=1

You should also consider joining the SGS as a member if your research will require translating requests  and contacting the archives:

http://www.rodoslovlje.com/en/content/what-sgs-membership

[yugaya]

Yes she did – the *church time* and *our* time differ – in their time writing back after a month or two  is not that long 😀 ( if you are lucky enough to get a reply in first attempt at all)

I've been away but am back now and will call via phone some more , that usually gets me at least to find a priest willing to communicate.

[yugaya]

So:

re the Albania Slavic settlements in the North and villages named BORIČ there – no surname BORIĆ in records, the  Serbian Orthodox settlers that first arrived in this area called VRAKA in 1810. did not have that surname among them (well documented community and its subsequent migrations). If there is an earlier Slavic connection in regard to the old toponym or Albanian surname BORICI, it did not stem from these settlers.

 BORIĆ people who immigrated to US mostly came from the LIKA – region of Austria-Hungary (today in Croatia) . LIKA was part of the MILITARY FRONTIER province where many people settled,  especially during the  XVIII century.

Significant clusters of  BORIĆ family who then later from LIKA  migrated further are found in Bosnia – region POUNJE, Bosanska Krajina.

I found only a few immigrants to US from the Split area, where the surname is documented in  XVII and XVIII century, and these may be also connected to the BORIĆ family on the island of BRAČ there, first documented in the vital records of the island in 1595.

Large presence of ethnic Serbs in Austro -Hungary with surname BORIĆ was in the VOJVODINA region in Serbia today (XIX century but I haven't looked at earlier records and documents in detail, and cannot tell you where they came from without that).

You will find both ethnic Serbs and ethnic Croats with this surname who emigrated from Austria-Hungary.

A more detailed analysis would mean consulting the Serbian Orthodox Church censuses, and Status Animarum recports  of the Roman Catholic Church from the Austria Hungary in all of the places where the surname appeared .

 

 

 

 

[yugaya]

Thank you for the offer , it would be an honor to work with SGS and  help establish a separate section on all *diaspora* Serbs of Croatia (Krajina, Hercegovina, Dalmacija and Slavonia), Bosnia, Slovenia and Hungary.

The mailing list neither of us posts on is the best example of how boards in English language that discuss researching  ethnic Serbian ancestry from the neighbouring countries have been filled with misleading advice, irrelevant links and recommendations for paid genealogissts who dispense false information to descendats and even contact SOC under false pretenses.  Not to mention the *experts* who fail to acknowledge the fact  that Serbs represent, both today and historically, the largest ethnic minority in their country.:D

So –  I would be thrilled to be able to direct  everyone to your website, where they will receive accurate and complete information on their ethnic Serbian ancestors-  that would minimize the *inaccuracies* and *forgetfulness* shown above in the future, and help more people discover their heritage and family history. That is the main reson why I volunteer information in the first place.

I dunno about my email notification settings, and I put the email in the sig because people hate to click profiles in most cases. :)))

(We can talk more via PMs on this)

 

EDIT: The image of the map showing eparchy borders and distribution of religions in 1880. is from Krstarica forum, where volunteers have digitalized parts of "Karlovačko vladičanstvo" book and made them available in this new format to general public.

[yugaya]

Please post the link for the Ellis island recors of your ancestor if you wish us to look and see if we can give you more information based  on that.

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