yugaya

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  • in reply to: Old import #39981
    Avatar photoyugaya
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    Please scan and send any documents ( the letter from the cousin too) to my email:

    [email protected] 

    People from Sjeničak and I have been working together with the church on documenting all emigrant families from this area.

    It has been an extremely difficult task reclaiming the heritage of the Serbs from Croatia from *experts* who claimed these people were Croatian – I made this information publicly available hoping it can help anyone researching their family origins from that parish in the future, and am so happy to see that it helped you.

    If you can make it to the 2015 gathering that would be amazing. I will do my best to reconnect you with the relatives for the occasion too. 🙂

     

    in reply to: Old import #39970
    Avatar photoyugaya
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    hungarian records are available online, also records for Basaid Roman Catholics. Give me a few days and I will look them up for you.

    in reply to: Old import #39969
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    Send me details on individuals you are researching and I will check what is available online that you can research on your own with our assistance before you hire anyone  – a lot of Roman Catholic records are available on Family Search for free and digital archives which charge a small fee in Hungary.

    in reply to: Old import #39913
    Avatar photoyugaya
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    Nikola Tesla  – his family origin is extremely well documented on both mothers and fathers side. You can find the article I wrote on that here:

     

    http://www.rodoslovlje.com/documentation/nikola-tesla-origin-and-family

     

    Also you need to establish original spelling of the surnames, first names and exact place of origin of your ancestors before you can find and prove any supposed link between your family and his.

    http://www.rodoslovlje.com/documentation/guide-researching-ethnic-serbian-ancestors-austria-hungary

    in reply to: Old import #39908
    Avatar photoyugaya
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    as the other family is certain that is their ancestor or relative if they want confirmation via tombstone of the data that is the bleakest way – there are death records that are available in Croatia in municipal office, if they have his date of birth finding his record of death is easy.

    Also a cheaper avenue ought to be pursued first, an attempt to locate living descendants of the same family who will take the pics for you for free of the headstones. Someone we assisted recently had that , his grandfather was the one who emigrated and his cousins sent him the great-grandfathers headstone pictures.

    Biskupija does not fit with who you are looking for as I have browsed the records that are available on familysearch.org and no ethnic Germans or record of marriage that would indicate a marriage between Serbian Orthodox man Popović and a woman of a different confession – Biskupija records are excellent and entire family history for XIX century can be reconstructed from them.

     

    in reply to: Old import #39904
    Avatar photoyugaya
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    – lots of questions only briefly but I will provide you with translations and quotes/ excerpts as the subject is very interesting:

    -The practice of ignoring family surnames of the Serbs by the Ottomans was ongoing in occupied territories until the end of their rule. Best examples of that are ethnic Serbian emigrants from Kosovo prior to liberation in 1912. who traveled with official Ottoman documents and their papers carried first name of the father instead of a surname of the family.

     

    We discussed that in detail for one of our members here:

    http://www.rodoslovlje.com/comment/4638#comment-4638

    -The belittling is evident in derogatory names of individuals and nicknames of clans given to ethnic Serbian families under Ottoman rule and first recorded in their defters, and later just carried on as surnames by the Austro(-Hungarian) conscription clerks when families migrated in XVI, XVII and XVIII century. There is a huge corpus of such pejorative surnames, and often in Serbian Orthodox Church archival materials and other historical sources the family or a clan is listed under its original family name. Sources for this would include all onomastics and etymology authors of authority of the region, including Petar Šimunović and Trifun Pavlović or Velimir Mihajlović.

    -As for the way they treated the Christian Serbs under their rule and the assumptions you made based on their ruling habits in the north – I will only highlight the example  of Ćele- Kula monument to their terror over Serbs.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skull_Tower

    -The census takers and clerks were not Serbian Orthodox ( Christians). Under Ottoman rule, they were not allowed to hold any such position without converting.

    -It is wrong to make assumptions based on etymology and onomastics of a different region or a different historical context – Ottoman rule in the examples and literature you cited was only of temporary nature and in many cases in parts where the inherited feudal apparatus remained almost intact. Ottoman oppression over most of ethnic Serbian origin areas lasted five centuries and you need to take that into account when you look at the development of surnames.

    -Also the variations between different areas are immense – for ethnic Serbs in Croatia the migration to Austrian or Venetian ruled territories meant that their surnames became solid and remained the same from as early as XV century when they were fist recorded, while in Serbia the patronimic swap with each new generation had to be ended with an official decree in 1851. and even later in Kosovo in 1912.

     

    -An example page from the Ottoman *name* census from 1528. of the  population in Smederevo town area, Serbia transcribed and published by the Oriental Institute in Sarajevo in a book "Turski katastarski popisi nekih područja zapadne Srbije XV i XVI vek" ( Ottoman land censuses of some areas in western Serbia in XV and XVI century).

    The district is called "Morava" ( nahija Morava) so of interest to your research directly.

    It is in Cyrillic script but all individuals are recorded without surnames, only as X son of Y ( or brother, uncle…)

     

    And as opposed to this manner of census taking I will list the example of Dečani monastery land and individuals censuses – "Dečanske hrisovulje" from 1330 and later as well as the merchant books from XV century of Dubrovnik city merchant Živan Pripčinović, in which Serbs are recorded with their valid surnames that can be tracked as such from there in other documents.

     

    -On questions regarding the surname MORAVKO later, as it is getting rather late. 🙂

     

     

    in reply to: Old import #39899
    Avatar photoyugaya
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    there is a cemetery in the smaller village of POPOVIĆI ( Biskupijs, Knin) which is the actual place of origin of that family there – in documents often the larger village or parish center was indicated as previous residence because smaller villages (zaselak) were administratively kept in records as part of the larger ones.

    You cannot obtain any records for Serbian- Orthodox cemeteries in Croatia except for Zagreb and a few coastal towns for the cemeteries which are inside the temple fence, but I posted on the excellent service for hire that is provided by Serbian Orthodox Church monks  where they are taking care of graves and are willing to go and photograph all headstones in a particular cemetary per request:

    http://www.rodoslovlje.com/forum/croatia/locating-and-photographing-headstones-and-cemeteries

    This is something you should consider after you establish the exact village of origin of your ancestor though, as there are no guarantees that a particular headstone still exists or that the inscriptions are readable.

    -photo of the Serbian Orthodox cemetery in Popovići village, Biskupija, Knin. It seems to be in great condition.

    in reply to: Old import #39897
    Avatar photoyugaya
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    I looked at the records you asked about and these are copies of church vital records made by Serbian Orthodox Church priests for the civil authorities.

     

    So whenever dealing with original SOC vital records, or copies made by its priests, the dates are according to the calendar it uses still – Julian, so a person who is in them listed as born on August 16th is according to western calendar born on August 29th ( the difference is that the calendar SOC uses is 13 days late, so we celebrate Serbian New Years Eve on January 13th when the old calendar says it is December 31st).

     

    In later records from XX century you will find two dates written as birth date – one in old calendar and in new calendar. The new calendar date is usually written in brackets.

     

    In this particular record and all receords from XIX century, two dates are:

    -first one date of birth

    -second one date of baptism

     

    and both in old calendar only, so always add + 13 days.

     

    The name of the child in that record  you found is JOVAN POPOVIĆ ( Јован Поповић).

    I am attaching a help for interpreting the records like this one based on the one you asked about:

    in reply to: Old import #39896
    Avatar photoyugaya
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    Can we upload books in .pdf format for members to read or research?

    in reply to: Old import #39895
    Avatar photoyugaya
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    Info on people who died in 1953. (and 1935) is available in civil vital records – this info will include their place of birth, their date of birth, the names of the parents, occupation of the parents, last residence and living relative who provided the info. You need to contact the municipal office in Bački Sokolac to obtain that info 8 perhaps you will need to hire and authorize a researcher to do that too, and provide proof of descendancy).

     

    BAČKI SOKOLAC is village in Vojvodina where many families of ethnic Serbs were relocated after the WWII, from Croatia and Bosnia – so that is why the info you received from a relative is probably accurate that some family is originally from Bosnia.

     

    in reply to: Old import #39894
    Avatar photoyugaya
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    You need to contact regional state archive in Novi Sad  and  Istorijski arhiv Vojvodine for information where the state vital records or microfilmed copies of church vital records are located and for which period they are available.

    Also keep in mind that all church vital records have been returned to religious communities and to obtain info from them you need to contact the church that your ancestors belonged to – that will depend on their religion but these will also be located in Novi Sad town.

    in reply to: Old import #39893
    Avatar photoyugaya
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    – "Stanin" means "the son of Stana" (female first name). In privrednik database, if caretaker is listed as anyone else but father that means that the father of the child is deceased. So Stana is the name of his mother.

     

    – The address in the records is the household number and the village – that is also the way the residence was entered into the vital records and the household number is vital info to distinguish between sometimes many families who carried same surname and lived in the same village  .

     

    – uč. is an abbreviation for word učitelj, teacher. most of the mentors were teachers and parish priests (paroh)

     

    Village is Sočanica. There is a very big Serbian online community on facebook for Dvor and Banija ( groups  – search for *Dvor* or * Banija Banijska sela* ), people from there can help you too:

    https://www.facebook.com/banijska?ref=ts&fref=ts

     

    You need to contact NENAD MENIĆANIN, one of the most respected Serbian genealogy researchers from that area, who has posted on his research of Borojević surname from Dvor area.

    here is his web page  in Serbian and extensive research on BOROJEVIĆ surname – contact him and you will be able to communicate with him directly in English:

     

    https://sites.google.com/site/menicanin/borojevi%C4%87

     

    his email:

    [email protected]

     

    I believe you also posted a question on hte availablity of vital records from Dvor area – these are only available to be researched in the Dvor town municipal office and researches I tried to arrange into ethnic Serbian ancestry there were not welcome. At all. I think that you ought to contact Sisak regional state archive and attempt to arrange a lookup through them if possible.

     

     

    in reply to: Old import #39892
    Avatar photoyugaya
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    Closest thing to that I found is a very large branch of the Poznić family that lived in RISOVAC, nowadays in Bosnia. The spelling you have may be result of a bad phonetic transcription on behalf of the person who wrote the info into the draft registration card, because the name of this village is pronounced :/ rɪsɒvʌtz/ *reese-o-vuts*.

     

    This village is near the town of Bosanski Petrovac and a person coming from it in 1905 would have been listed as coming from Austria as country of origin ( Bosnia had been occupied by the Austria-Hungary empire since 1878.)

     

    There is one other location that starts with "R" – Rogoža, Veliko Vukovje in Croatia where I found Poznić family in period records – so keep that as an option open too before you  confirm your ancestors place of origin.

     

    Yes, every  bit of even the tiniest info you can find in records after emigrating is helpful. And also, please always try to either attach here to your posts l the documents you find – often a native speaker will interpret ship manifests and other documents more accurately, and the more people see it more chances you get of correct interpretation.

     

    in reply to: Old import #39853
    Avatar photoyugaya
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    Thank You for registering and posting this, hopefully your relative will see it. 🙂 I will repost it on our facebook page as well as on ancestry.com too to make it more visible.

     

    Hvala vam Momire puno na javljanju i informacijama.

    in reply to: Old import #39848
    Avatar photoyugaya
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    ( in immigration documents rarely is the exact place of origin listed – usually it is a larger municipal or parish centre.)

     

    Dr SRZENTIĆ is listed in the memorial book of Serbian volunteers 1912-1918,  tto have taken part in foreign medical volunteer missions on the side of Serbia during the WWI ( 1914-1918). His place of origin listed in that book is Boka Kotorska, Montenegro and he is identified as a doctor.

    Boka Kotorska is a bay and BUDVA town is part of the same coastal region of Montenegro.

    I found family SRZENTIĆ in period records in first half of the XX century living in that region, in villages PETROVAC (Budva municipality) and SOTONIĆI ( Bar municipality). You ought to look for relatives in these locations there is probably someone still residing in the birthplace of your ancestor from the same family.

    https://www.google.hu/#hl=en&gs_nf=1&tok=gCHwoDewX_INCI7DKEhe-Q&cp=14&gs_id=h0&xhr=t&q=Budva+Srzenti%C4%87&pf=p&sclient=psy-ab&oq=Budva+Srzenti%C4%87&gs_l=&pbx=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf.&fp=5d6f9ca7f7e6cf2c&biw=1366&bih=583

    *Ragjenovic* is not a valid surname – you should be looking for relatives under the surname RAĐENOVIĆ ( may also be spelled: RADJENOVIĆ ).

     

    For tips on how to locate and contact descendants see our general research section  article:

    http://www.rodoslovlje.com/en/documentation/guide-researching-ethnic-serbian-ancestors-austria-hungary

    ( local forums in local languages, local media outlets,  localized family/town facebook  groups,  contact via Serbian and Montenegrin organizations in USA, as well as Serbian Orthodox Church is recommended.  I suggest you post on the Cafe Del Montenegro website forum : http://www.cdm.me/, among other places – best chance for someone to reply to you in English)

    – The reason why his *country* of origin is listed in immigration documents as *Dalmatia* is because that is what these territories were jointly called under foreign rule (occupation).

    Balkan Wars  ( First Balkan War and Second Balkan War) took place in 1912. and 1913. , so the years you are referring to (1908. and 1909.) when he took part in missions in the region were not during them . 🙂

    from an article "SERBIAN AMERICANS" by Bosiljka Stevanović on first Serbian immigrants and their organizations in late XIX century, a passage on early Bokelji immigrants ( immigrants from Boka Kotorska, Montenegro) where dr Srzentić is mentioned as one of the pioneers :

    The First Cultural and Fraternal Organizations

    We have no information on the number of Serb immigrants in Chicago in the late nineteenth century. They began to settle in the city in the late 1880’s. During the Columbian International Exposition, Chicago’s first World Fair held in 1893, the city organized a public event involving the participation of all the ethnic groups living in Chicago. We know that “there were enough Serbs to join the ‘Parade of Nations’ as Serbians—flag and all—after winning a protest against being classed as
    ‘Austro-Hungarians’ and later grouped with many others as just ‘Slavs’.”2 The need and capability of the local Serbs to promote their specific ethnic identity on this occasion reflects the earliest efforts of the Chicago Serbs to act in an organized manner.

    The founding of the first Serbian cultural organization in Chicago is associated with one of the first Serb immigrants in this city. His name was Ivan Vučetić. He was a Serb from Budva, one of many Serbs from Boka Kotorska (Bokelji) that had arrived in America during the first period of immigration in the nineteenth century. Most of the Bokelji had settled in the coastal areas around New Orleans, New York, and especially San Francisco. During the Gold Rush, some of them settled in California’s hinterland and Alaska. Others sought jobs in mines and industrial centers and established communities in Butte (Montana), Douglas (Alaska), Chicago, etc. The Bokelji were later joined by immigrants from Herzegovina and subsequently by many more from Serbian lands within Austria-Hungary. Vučetić and his fellow Bokelji living in Chicago decided in 1878 to establish a cultural and educational club, which they named Obilić. As the membership of the club grew, in 1881 the organization was renamed and reorganized as the cultural club; it was transformed into a fraternal society called the First Montenegrin Benevolent Society (Prvo crnogorsko dobrotvorno društvo).

    3 The society was mentioned in the minutes of another Serbian society founded in 1880 in San Francisco, the Serbian-Montenegrin Literary and Benevolent Society (Srpsko-crnogorsko literarno i dobrotvorno društvo), which welcomed the establishment of the Chicago organization. As the San Francisco society had already been registered, they assisted the new organization in Chicago by sending them their charter and by-laws.4 In 1895 the Chicago fraternal organization changed its name to Serbian Unity (Srpsko Jedinstvo).

    By the last decade of the nineteenth century, there was a number of local and regional Serbian fraternal organizations in America. The biggest were the Serbian-Montenegrin Literary and Benevolent Society in San Francisco, Serbian Unity in Chicago, United Serbs (Sjedinjeni Srbi) in New York and Serbian Unity (Srpsko jedinstvo) in Butte. The Chicago organization was the first to attempt uniting all Serb organizations on the national level. The initiative came from Špiro Srzentić, former editor of the San Francisco newspaper Liberty, and was publicly advocated by Vasa Dinić, former president of United Serbs. In 1899 the Chicago organization began lobbying for unification, which was later accepted by three of the above-mentioned organizations, but not by the one in San Francisco. It seems the federation was formally established in 1903. It was based in Chicago and named the First Serbian Fraternal Benevolent Federation (Prvi srpski bratski dobrotvorni savez) or FSFBF.

    3. The First Serbian Fraternal Benevolent Federation

    The San Francisco society did not join, probably because at that time it was better organized than other Serbian organizations in America.5 This was due to the fact that San Francisco had for several decades been the home of one of the oldest and most numerous Serbian communities in America. During the last two decades of the nineteenth century, San Francisco was the most important Serbian-American cultural center and the home of the first Serbian newspapers published in America: the short-lived Serbian American (Srbin Amerikanac) began publication in 1893, at the same time as Liberty (Sloboda), founded by members of the Serb-Montenegrin Literary and Benevolent Society.6Liberty was for some time the only Serbian newspaper in the country. For several years the San Francisco-Oakland area had two Serbian newspapers: Liberty and Serbian Independence (Srpska nezavisnost) [End Page 36] established in 1904. Both newspapers featured a number of articles on the FSFBF.

    When the process of establishing this federation began in 1899, Chicago had no Serbian language newspapers, so Liberty from San Francisco was asked to act as their unofficial organ. This cooperation lasted until 1903, when Liberty published one of its last articles regarding the activities of the FSFBF—its annual convention held in August 1903. The article gives us an insight into the organizations that were members of the federation at that time: Serbian Unity (Chicago), United Serbs (New York), Serbian-Slavic Benevolent Unity (Anaconda), Serbian Unity (Butte), Serbian Benevolent Society (Angels Camp) and Serbian Benevolent Unity (Los Angeles).

    By this time, a competing federation of fraternal societies had been established in Pittsburgh by Serbian immigrants, mainly from Krajina, who were arriving in large numbers at the turn of the century. Most of them settled in Pennsylvania and found jobs in the mines and steel mills located in this area. Their organization, established in 1901, was called the Serbian Orthodox Society Srbobran (Srpski pravoslavni savez Srbobran). This was the only federation that had a religious marker in its name. Initially, its official organ was a newspaper titled The Srbin (Srbin), published in Pittsburgh, and publicized as “the only Servian weekly newspaper in Eastern States in the U.S.”

Viewing 15 posts - 91 through 105 (of 242 total)